TheKennel PI account no longer under TheKennel control

[Pinkshadow]

I'm so glad I've grown a thick skin over the years, because some of the comments here are the most despicable that I've seen in a while regarding myself and the rest of the MOD team.

WE CANNOT ACCESS ANYONE'S ACCOUNT ON PI. WE CANNOT CHANGE A PASSWORD, OR AN EMAIL ADDRESS, OR ANY OTHER INFORMATION ABOUT AN ACCOUNT. We certainly cannot transfer the ownership of an account.

This was already stated in the screen-shots provided, but I'm going to assume it was missed in an overzealous level of excitement regarding the witch burning.

Well that just makes PI and their mod a poor side . Everything can be hacked with or without having the password, and what will you do then? If a person's account get hacked without the owner of the account have given the password out? You'll just say "Sorry, you will have to pay for a new account and you have lost everything you worked for..." or what?? >.<

Having said that..
@Rekka, Wolfs Fang & Shadowphyr , So your basicly saying, if your giving a friend you trust the key to your house and she steals from you its okay, because you gave her the key? darn your wierd or live a strange place with strange laws then, and i can make excellent history, because i have a story like this for my self atm;
I live in Denmark and we have CLEAR laws about stealing. A year ago i bought a Laptop with internet in my name for a inlaw woman, i trusted her to give me the money it costed each month (about 50 Dollars) but she didnt, she always came up with a lameexcuse that she didnt have any and blabla. and yes its my own fault i owe a company money cause of this BUT as she havnt payed ANYTHING the computer BELONGS to me, so i have called the policed and told dem, because she wouldnt give the laptop to me freely.
My point is ; Just because you give a person you trust something, if they do like Perf did or my inlaw it is still STEALING !

[Garney]

I do still believe that everyone is free to speak their mind. However, I have never felt comfortable with talking badly about PI. I've avoided this thread all day because it upset me so badly.

Yes, you are free to say good or bad or neutral things about anything, but please don't put words in other people's mouths so to speak. Several times I've wanted to shut down threads that I felt were overly negative (sometimes not PI related), but I strongly believe in the right to free expression. I just wish that sometimes that expression was more positive.

I left PI for my own reasons and I was done with it. I left with the confidence that my ponies would be safely dead awaiting resurrection on my accounts should I ever choose to return, which I've done in the past. And it certainly isn't the only game I've ever quit, so it gets just as much of my attention as all the rest of them - none. The Kennel staff continued on closing out what needed to be closed for quite awhile afterwards and I trusted them to that. I should have just gotten over my anxiety and gone back to check that everything was closed out. That's my own fault. And I do trust people, also my fault.

We pursued the issue with an attempt at respect and politeness. We were returned politeness and an answer to the letter of that site's code of conduct. That's it, case closed, and here is the information straight from the source so there's no bias. That's all the thread was for, the account is being used by someone else so be aware.

[Rekka]

Right, so I was going to leave things well enough alone, but this has my attention:

Rekka, Wolfs Fang & Shadowphyr , So your basicly saying, if your giving a friend you trust the key to your house and she steals from you its okay, because you gave her the key?

Don't put words in my mouth. I thought I made it pretty clear at the start of my post:

I'm not here to say whether I thought Perf was right or wrong in doing what she's done.

My post isn't about whether I thought she was right or wrong. I do not possess all the information from both sides. Furthermore I cannot confirm which parts are true, which are exaggerated, etc., so I cannot make that kind of judgment. Not going to go into "if it were me..." because that isn't the object here. I offered my best solution to minimize damages - that is, contacting Perf and asking her nicely to change the name of the account- and that was all on that matter, aside from the reimbursement thing which I misread badly.

My problem was that The Kennel staff made an error, publicly showed it (the motives for this are irrelevant), and people immediately come in and start bawwwing that PI is evil and out to ruin their lives. Which it is not.

You may have freedom of speech here, but just because you can doesn't mean you should. When it's deserved, go for it. But when you're not involved personally, or you don't have your facts straight, mindless flaming just makes you look like an uninformed jerk.

[Neocridders]

Hi Rekka. I do agree with what you said...

You may have freedom of speech here, but just because you can doesn't mean you should. When it's deserved, go for it. But when you're not involved personally, or you don't have your facts straight, mindless flaming just makes you look like an uninformed jerk.

And we can't really know the full story.
I don't know for what reasons Perf paid for the account, and I don't know who the account should belong to.
This is a tough misunderstanding situation, and it is not fair for Perf to make her out as the bad guy without
solid evidence that she is the one who did this, and it is especially not fair to accuse someone, flame her behind her back,
and the accused has no way to defend herself.

I have said things before I regret later. Most of them via the internet. Well, I know most of it was an 'in the moment' sort of thing.

Has anyone ever read the Lord of the Flies?
There is a scene where the boys are excited from their hunt. They have pig, and they are proud of it.
They have a 'dance' to re-enact the killing of the pig, in this dance the hunters are catching the pig (the role of the pig is played by one of the boys)
Well, it is stormy weather, and it is dark. Everyone is living in the moment. No one knows what they are doing.
A boy, Simon, stumbles out of the woods to the beach where the rest of the boys are having their dance.
No one realizes it is Simon. In the confusion of the dance, the boys claw and tear and stab at Simon.
Simon is murdered. The boys would not have gone up to Simon and killed him if they were not in the moment and everyone else was doing it too.

I bring this up because, in a way, I feel this thread has gone towards that direction. When the thread was started, one person might have posted something pro secundi,
then another pro secundi post, then some anti-pi posts, and then some pro pi posts, and we have ourselves an almost out of control discussion.
It is really something someone does that is in the moment, sometimes. Making an Anti pi post because someone else has already posted something
pro secundi, and more similar posts file in... and then we don't know what is going on.

I think it was fine that the thread made here, but it has gotten more into a debate of PI vs. Secundi. The thread was not made
to bash PI. I don't exactly know the purpose, but it was not to bash pi.

PI is a great place. If I had more time in my life right now, I'd be there more that I have been.

I don't really know why I am bringing this up. I guess I just feel it should be mentioned
that you don't know what the reasons were for Perf renewing the account, or changing the password, or anything else.
Now, if anyone here posting these responses here do know the full story, then that is fine. Post what you think.
Let us not destroy each other or our thoughts of others just because we think we know what is happening.

:/

[springacres]

I second Neocridders' post.  I too still have accounts on PI, and I enjoy both sites, for different reasons.  I really like the smaller community and well-run, inexpensive, HQ adoptables that can be found here.  On PI, I also enjoy various HQ adoptables, and as many of you know, I am also involved in the Azuyan roleplay.

I personally believe Perf was wrong to do what she did, and that was the source of my outrage on this issue.  However, that is my opinion only.  As Garney has stated, PI mods handled the issue within their site's ownership policy.  It sounds to me as though they really were trying to help Garney recover ownership, but that ultimately there was nothing they could do.

[Silvanon]

It occurs to me that some people might be wondering or concerned now, since it was suggested in this thread that Secundi staff might be able to see your Secundi passwords.  If so, please allow me to lay those fears to rest.  While we are able to reset your password if needed, we are not able to see what password you currently have in the system.  Passwords are encrypted before being entered into the database, so even if I went hunting there, I couldn't tell what your password is.

[Neocridders]

I am sorry I even put that possibility out there, Silvanon.
Sorry to anyone who was worried because of that idea. I was just trying to throw ideas out there.

[indigowulf]

My password is ******!! (asterics, asterics, ect ect)
that's one of the funniest thing ive ever heard during customer service- that statement would mean Im an utter genious, or a doofus

[Shadowphyr]

I was going to simply leave what I said as it was and not comment further, however this caught my eye:

@Rekka, Wolfs Fang & Shadowphyr , So your basicly saying, if your giving a friend you trust the key to your house and she steals from you its okay, because you gave her the key?

The problem is, everyone is going on about how somebody stole something someone else had paid for.  The fact of the matter is, the account was left open for people to access and went inactive.  This person did not "take the keys and steal" anything.  In fact, the account was unpaid for and she paid for it.  She didn't walk into an account someone else paid for and take everything out of it.  If I gave the keys to my house to a friend, and she came in and took stuff that she paid for, whether it was in my house or not I have no claim.

Everyone is going on about how Perf "stole" something that belonged to somebody else.  The fact of the matter is she was given access and then renewed the account with her own money.  The only one out money on this is Perf.  Somebody who was given access to the account and had full reign while the adoptable was still on PI, and even afterward.

I mean seriously.  The whole point of this thread was to inform everyone on Secundi that the Kennel account was no longer under Garney's control, not a free go-ahead to bash PI or users on PI, which is all I happen to see going on here.  PI is not out to get anybody, they're certainly not aiming their lasers at any one person, and they most certainly don't take down names of the people they decide they might want to smite in the future.  Nobody's out to get you, but that seems to be all I ever see here.  Somebody brings up something that happened on PI, and the entire thread turns into a "That's typical of PI, nothing but a bunch of whiny losers with vendettas against everyone who left to join Secundi...I know who you are" thread. 

Which is exactly why I hadn't originally wanted to make an account here.  All the flagrant butt-hurt against PI I see over here, all the time, is frankly the most childish behavior I've ever seen.  But this ....this really tee'd me off.  I'm tired of seeing people who are butt-hurt over something they feel is some personal vendetta against them being the only thing I ever see coming out of Secundi.  I'm tired of seeing people being condemned because you think someone is being personally targeted for something they aren't.  Honestly...what's the deal?  Every little thing that happens on PI turns into some kind of crusade against how horrible those people are, how terrible and/or lazy the staff there is because they cannot do something.

I never once said PI is great, or that they know all.  I never mounted a righteous crusade to defend it or the people who still go there, nor did I come here just to "defend" PI and flame Secundi.  In fact, I don't recall saying a single thing bad about Secundi OR martyring PI.  In fact, what I did say was that you all are prepping the pitchforks against something that PI has no control over and could have been handled and prevented in the beginning by the very person who made the PSA that Kennel is NOT on PI.  To INFORM you.  Not to mount a slander campaign against how horrible PI is. 

Seriously.  Grow up.

Garney, I'm sorry all this is happening to you, and I understand it sucks.  I only hope maybe this will be a learning lesson for the future, yeah?  At the very least....change your passwords when you leave, kay?  Cover your own backside in the end.  It's all you can do, but it's a big step towards preventing things like this happening again, ne?  *hugs*  I still love you (even if my last post didn't seem to sound like that.  >.>).

[red_uni387]

Shads it's more the fact that Perf (if it is her) knew the account was shared and even got a 'no' from Garney about renewing it and went ahead and renewed it anyway It's not fair to the rest of the staff who wanted to leave PI in peace...

[Shadowphyr]

runi, no offense, but if you re-read the conversations, Perf had asked to renew a different account.  Not the Kennel.  I'll even quote directly from the images provided.

I'll also add that a couple months ago she asked me if she could renew one of my other accounts to use, and I told her no.

Again.  Different account.  She was told nothing about the Kennel account as Garney went on further to say that the Kennel account was handled without her knowledge.  I honestly can see how a person might get the idea that a shared account is shared property.  I'm not saying it's right, and I'm not saying it's acceptable.  So before anyone decides to cast the first stone because I don't agree with them that PI is full of dirty, rotten scoundrels out to snub out the existences of those they don't like, keep that in mind.

Half of this is about taking responsibility, the other half is about actually listening to what other people are saying.  This thread wasn't meant to flame PI, but that's what it became.  Ironic, considering no one here wants to see anyone flaming Secundi, and even go to the lengths of suggesting threads be locked before it becomes a flame war, and yet the only bad talking going on is against PI.  The second somebody comes up pointing out facts and common sense, suddenly we're all flaming, degrading, or insulting Secundi, and we should be silenced.  And underneath it all, everyone seems to be missing the point and only reading what they want to.

Edit:  Removing some bits out of respect for Silvanon, and her asking me to do so.

[red_uni387]

oh...I must have read that part too fast, thought she had asked about renewing the Kennel account Dx bah, completely disregard my post then, isn't correct with information

[Goddesss]

I have avoided replying to this thread because a) I didn't want to get into it  b)It was meant to let people know that TheKennel account was no longer under TheKennels control.

A lot of the responses in this thread have bothered me and I have just kept quiet.  We all know why this site was created.  Whether people feel that TheKennel was or wasn't personally targeted by PI is really up the individual person as there will never be any proof to the issue.  Nor does it really matter.  People can make their own opinions and can do as they please as far as PI is concerned.  Yes I sorta left PI because my account expired and I didnt have the money that month to renew it.  I did get the money.  I realized that yes I missed some of the adoptables I loved on PI, but I certainly did not miss alot of the things I dont like about PI.  So I havent been willing to spend my money on it and most likely will not again.

The people who started this site have never told anyone you should leave PI and they are usually  pretty quiet in threads where people are talking about PI.  They have just given anyone who wanted some place else to go just that.  Yes here we can speak our minds and usually do.  If someone doesn't like PI and makes a thread about it that is perfectly fine.  PI is not the only topic people make threads complaining about.  Anyone who wants to join this site is welcome.  I do find it awfully funny though that every time there is a thread about PI a PI Mod or members who don't frequent this site come here giving their opinions.  Do you guys Mod this site as well as PI?  Honestly no one is going on PI giving their opinions there.  I dont see anything wrong with who ever wanting to give their opinions doing it as that is what we all do here.  I just dont understand if you dont want to be here why you monitor these boards.


I will not give my opinion of PI here as I don't think it matters and everyone is free to come to their own opinion about it.

The problem is, everyone is going on about how somebody stole something someone else had paid for.  The fact of the matter is, the account was left open for people to access and went inactive.  This person did not "take the keys and steal" anything.  In fact, the account was unpaid for and she paid for it.  She didn't walk into an account someone else paid for and take everything out of it.  If I gave the keys to my house to a friend, and she came in and took stuff that she paid for, whether it was in my house or not I have no claim.

Everyone is going on about how Perf "stole" something that belonged to somebody else.  The fact of the matter is she was given access and then renewed the account with her own money.  The only one out money on this is Perf.  Somebody who was given access to the account and had full reign while the adoptable was still on PI, and even afterward.

Well actually she is using the BP on the account.  If you want to get nit picky about she paid for it how can she be stealing.  So essentially it would be more like your friend paid for your house and then came in and stole your stuff from the house.  Also none of us know if she was given full reign of the account or what terms were set forth for her to use the account.

I mean seriously.  The whole point of this thread was to inform everyone on Secundi that the Kennel account was no longer under Garney's control, not a free go-ahead to bash PI or users on PI, which is all I happen to see going on here.  PI is not out to get anybody, they're certainly not aiming their lasers at any one person, and they most certainly don't take down names of the people they decide they might want to smite in the future.  Nobody's out to get you, but that seems to be all I ever see here.  Somebody brings up something that happened on PI, and the entire thread turns into a "That's typical of PI, nothing but a bunch of whiny losers with vendettas against everyone who left to join Secundi...I know who you are" thread.

If you don't like what you see here no one is forcing you to stay.  You don't know if PI is out to get someone or not.  Nobody can ever know what goes on behind closed doors.  If someone wants to comment about how PI is out to get them that is their right just as you have a right to say that they aren't.  I also dont think any threads have stated that PI is out to get anyone who left to join Secundi.  Mostly just people complaining about how PI runs their site.  Yes it is their site they can run it how they want to, but their is nothing wrong with someone giving their views on it here.  

nor did I come here just to "defend" PI and flame Secundi.  In fact, I don't recall saying a single thing bad about Secundi OR martyring PI.  In fact, what I did say was that you all are prepping the pitchforks against something that PI has no control over and could have been handled and prevented in the beginning by the very person who made the PSA that Kennel is NOT on PI.

That is exactly what you have done here.  Defended PI and flamed Secundi.  You may not have said anything about Secundi as a site but you have talked about the people who are here.  Also PI could have changed the password and given it back to Garney.  That doesnt mean they should have.  I do remember reading in their rules about giving your password out at your own risk and that if you have given your password out then you are responsible for what that person does with your account.  I went to find that and quote it but it has apparently been edited so I wont bother.  So yes they do have the capability to do it but chose not to based on their rules.

Seriously.  Grow up.

This is just rude.  Once again if you dont like it here you are not forced to be here.  

[CutieePiee]

Very well put, Goddesss... exactly my thoughts.

I haven't seen that many sign-ups for Secundi until shortly after this thread was made.. Maybe it's coincidence, but why the need to sign up for a site just so you can defend PI against opinions? Let it be negative or positive opinions, like Goddesss stated, if you don't like it, don't bother reading this or coming here.

Secundi and Ponyisland are clearly not affiliated. The only connection is the users, as some people have continued to stay on PI while also coming here. PI has made it clear that they do not want Secundi links and buttons anywhere on its site. Why would you come here to tell us what to talk about and what not to talk about? There shouldn't be a reason for PI to enforce any rules on us here.

Who are you to tell us what we shouldn't do?

You may have freedom of speech here, but just because you can doesn't mean you should. When it's deserved, go for it. But when you're not involved personally, or you don't have your facts straight, mindless flaming just makes you look like an uninformed jerk.

To say that someone looks like a jerk.. and to tell someone to grow up (quoted above)-- well that's just plain mean.  

[Goddesss]

Thank you Cutiee.  I also wanted to comment on the quote you put but couldnt think of a way to put it nicely.  Well said.

[Wolfs Fang]

Just more proof that Secundi is stupid >.<
This here just shows me how childish Secundi is. I mean you know they are doing this because of who you guys are.
I mean really just WOW
=/ I hate to say it, but Secundi's ADMINS are really nothing but greedy and lazy sometimes
i just really loathe Secundi and the people who run it for how they run it..dang
Sorry i just hate to see bad things said about PI because really its just beyond great.
OMFG !!! Secundi is just soo soo stupid, im so glad i dont use my money and time in that place anymore <3

[Goddesss]

Hehehe sorry you feel that way Wolfs Fang =)

[Lectral]

MOD note:

I would like to post a warning; I am not going to lock this, as discussion and opinions are allowed, but the comments are starting to get a little personal, and a little more heated than I am comfortable allowing to continue.  This post was meant as a public announcement, to let anyone who is still on PI know that TheKennel account might be active on PI, but the adoptable itself has not returned, and the person using the account is not affiliated with the adoptable's current, active staff.

Letting off steam about PI policies, or Secundi policies, or anywhere else that may have annoyed you is fine, everyone needs to vent now and then.  But this thread has come quite far off-topic, and I would prefer if it returned to its purpose.

Thank you

[Neocridders]

That response made my day, Wolf Fang.

It sounds like everything that has been said about PI, only with secundi replaced in it...
*giggles*
Of course, I find none of that true. I don't hate PI either, though.
*huggles all Secundi Admins*

[Wolfs Fang]

Just more proof that Secundi is stupid >.<
This here just shows me how childish Secundi is. I mean you know they are doing this because of who you guys are.
I mean really just WOW
=/ I hate to say it, but Secundi's ADMINS are really nothing but greedy and lazy sometimes
i just really loathe Secundi and the people who run it for how they run it..dang
Sorry i just hate to see bad things said about PI because really its just beyond great.
OMFG !!! Secundi is just soo soo stupid, im so glad i dont use my money and time in that place anymore <3

That said, I don't really hate Secundi. This was done just to prove a point.

Look at what was written above. I'm flaming Secundi, correct? And if you play Secundi, what I said in the post above probably made you feel angry and frustrated, right?

So... if you feel that way when I post something like that, how do you think some people on PI feel when they see PI being bashed? When I said this, people didn't stay silent about it. And PI'ers didn't stay silent when they saw PI being bashed. They've done the exact same things that people on Secundi have done then they saw Secundi being bashed. Now, can you really blame PI'ers for speaking up? The exact same things have been written about PI. Don't believe me? Look back over this thread for proof. I took exact quotes from what people said, and just replaced the word "PI" with the word "Secundi. "

Anyway, here's my point. I understand why some people here have a grudge against PI. But really.... Does that justify the bashing of PI that goes on almost every time someone posts a thread about it? I know that there is fault on both sides, but please... I'm very tired of the debating and arguing that's going on. Peace treaty, anyone? 

And again, what I wrote before was just to prove a point. I didn't mean to offend anyone, and I don't really hate Secundi.

EDIT: I needed to bold something ^^

~Fang

[indigowulf]

One huge difference there, fangy. We are complaining about something in a place where people have come to enjoy something seperate from pi. we are not ON pi bashing them. if we were, we could get our posts locked, deleted, or even get banned. However, people are coming here, to secundi, people who dont care anything about secundi in any way, just to play big brother and watch to see if we say anything about them.

If you (the great metaphorical "you",not any individual) dont like it here, you dont have to be here. Isnt that what PI says? If you dont like it here, theres really no reason to sign up *just* to say you dont like things here. That makes no sense at all! (not talking about people who are here as part of the community and just voicing thier side)

Now I still play on PI. I have friends there. I havent had any personal negative experiences.

All else aside, this will effect my own personal dealings with the person, because my *openion* of thier actions changes how I wish to deal with them. Im grateful this post was made, so I could be aware of this.  I personally would have be very confused to see thekennel account active, and I say thank you for the PM letting people know it wasnt the kennel staff, so we didnt get posts on PI asking about it. That may have led to innocent, confused people getting in trouble. So, thank you for this post, and the intention behind it.

[Goddesss]

Very well put indigowulf =)

[Sunchaser]

i have stayed out of this thread to and must say the thread has made me laugh <.<

But i wanted to say i do agree with Indigo wolf. i do believe its childish to come here just to say we are childish when "you" yourself are here for no reason.

*clings to all secundi'ers and some of the pi users* i have n problem with either site i just dont feel like renewing my account though i do have to figure out how to contact people about my adoptables there <.< hmm

[Wolfs Fang]

I'd like to point out a few things, and then I'll (probably) stay quiet.

1. I originally posted in this thread with the intention to try and be helpful by making a suggestion.

2. I did not make the fake Secundi bashing post to offend anyone. I did not mean anything I said in that post. It was made only to prove a point.

3. Again, I did not join Secundi simply so I could defend PI. I joined because I like some of the adoptables available here.

------------------------------------------------
(seperate list)
1. No matter their reason for joining, people on Secundi still have the right to post their opinions.

2. Whether it's done on or off a site, bashing is still bashing. It's still done thoughtlessly, and it still hurts people's feelings.

3. This thread has turned from its original purpose of notifying that TheKennel PI account is no longer being controlled by the same people. Now, it's become more of a PI bashing/PI vs. Secundi thread. As I said before, can't we all just... stop arguing? I know some people here feel that they have been wronged by PI in the past, but there's no reason to drag it up every time that the subject of PI is mentioned.

Anyway, I'm just going to stay quiet after this. I've already said all that I want to say, and any more would just be repetitive. I don't want to argue, and I'm sorry if I've offended anyone.

~Fang

[Keeper]

it does seem that even though freedom of speech is allowed here that  ...... *bashes self to shut up*

sorry someone stole your account.
They do have the power to return the account and they just cant be bothered to actually get thier hands dirty.

[Soup]

it does seem that even though freedom of speech is allowed here that  ...... *bashes self to shut up*

sorry someone stole your account.
They do have the power to return the account and they just cant be bothered to actually get thier hands dirty.

No.  We DON'T have the power to return the account and we have explained the reasons why to the people involved - which you can see right there for yourself.

Its like giving someone the PIN number to your bank card, if they take money out without asking you, then you are responsible and the bank will not refund you for that.  Making sure the password to your account is safe is up to you - again it would be different if the person in question just hijacked the account after Garney had changed the passwords - THAT is hacking.  Having the password itself is having authorised access.

After this I won't come back here - I actually enjoyed posting here in respect of PonyMama's pets (how are thy doing by the way?) but reading things like this just, I dunno.  My skin obviously isn't as thick as others.

(also in respect of people signing up to "Defend" PI - if someone was bashing many of YOUR friends on another site, would you not step up to defend them?  We're not defending PI as such, we are defending our friends.)

[Goddesss]

(also in respect of people signing up to "Defend" PI - if someone was bashing many of YOUR friends on another site, would you not step up to defend them?  We're not defending PI as such, we are defending our friends.)

The amusing part about it isn't that you are defending your friends or PI.  Its that you (not you literally) are lurking these boards just waiting for us to make a "PI bashing thread"so you can give your two cents.  At least that is how it seems as most of the time it is the only threads you actually post in.

[indigowulf]

Bashing a place isnt the same as bashing the people who live there. Here in Washington, USA, there is a city called Tacoma. I *hate* Tacoma. Despise it with a passion. It's filthy, smoggy, the streets havent been fixed in years, the crime rate is high, the schools get some of the worst grades in the state, so on and so forth. Yet, 2 of my best friends in this world live there.

I dont like the way the city is run. The city officials of Tacoma may have a reason to take that personal, if they choose. People living there should not do so, in fact, Im one of thier advocates, I think the roads should be fixed, and other things as well, to make life better for those living there. I love those people and wish them the best.

Now, perhaps not everyone has the same feelings. But i dont believe anyone here feels that the players on PI are stupid or childish or anything else. If you are a PI player reading this thread, please know I dont hate you, and I doubt anyone here does. Some of you I downright adore. I do feel the "city planning" could use improvement in certain areas, but that isnt a reflection of you.

[Goddesss]

very well put indigowulf.

[Keeper]

exactly, i have no problems with any player on pi at all, i have many friends on there.
the fact that you are argueing on pi's behalf and calling yourself "WE" seems to me you dont really understand why we are upset. Its not the players most of the time its the way things are handled.

and when we say they we are not aiming it at the mods as we know you just do what your told in the end and do your best xx