PM's hard few years

[PonyMama]

ok so I am going to explain as much as I need to but need to get this off my chest and everyone in my life seems to always think that this is me, what I do, how I act and not anyone else, It is never anyone else, it is always me.  Sorry for any spelling mistakes too, I am trying to write this while I have no hubby here.

Ok I was 15 when I met my ex, we were together for almost 3 years.  It only took 1 for it to be emotionally unhealthy, and another 6 months for it to be physically wrong.  It got so bad I finally snapped and started to defend myself.  Well let me tell you, a pair of chunky high heels to a knee when you have a 6'1 guy on you hitting you can do some damage, and if you can ever get the upper hand, and put all your weight into a hold you can keep him down, and then if you have your hair being pulled and when he comes in for a hit you can manage to get a hold of his thumb with your teeth, show no mercy.   

This is how it was when I was 18, with him.  Nothing anyone should deal with and I had to get out, but I knew he would not let me leave, so I told him what I could to make him give me some space, "I want to see other people"

[PonyMama]

I asked some guy out in my grade 12 English class, it was hard as I had been out of the dating swing for so long being in what should have been a committed relationship, but what I now call hell.  He said yes and picked me up that afternoon/evening.  I was thrilled as he was cute, and nice, but I was weary, and untrusting.  It went great, and we even went to meet some people we both knew as we drove past their house.  Ok this is where things get fun.  Apparently this is when I met Scott, I even got in his car and went for a "drive" with a bunch of other friends.  (I don't smoke pot but know many people who do)  I didn't notice him, but apparently he noticed me.  Why would I notice him, I was on a date?

The next night was Friday and there was a huge bush party, and my crush, the guy I went out with was going to be there, so I asked two of my girlfriends to spend the night and lets go (I was living on my own so it was easy enough to go out).  We hike out to this party and I had a few drinks and with the amount of pot being smoked I ended up with quite the buzz, which did not help when it started to rain, which confused me in my condition, and the guy I was suppose to meet took off without me, but gave a bunch of other girls a ride out of the bush.  So I guess the three of us were hoofing it out ourselves.

I only lived a short distance from the party but we decided we wanted food, so walked the opposite direction to the store, to which in the parking lot we meet up with a bunch of people from school and a few that weren't.  I was cold, wet and miserable, and they all decided to smoke some more, and I refused, as I always have.  The guy who ditched us was there and I firmly told him I was sitting in his truck and there was nothing he could do about it, since they were all piled into one car smoking.

After this moment he wanted to leave and now I was cold, wet, mad and sober, and farther away from home since we were almost at the store, so I didn't want to walk home, but my friends told me that three guys were giving us a ride, and coming for a visit. "HUH?"  Ok I guess, as long as I meet them first.  Well I knew two of them already, and was friends with them, and one of their girlfriends. So now I was fine.

They did indeed come for a visit, and I met Scott, he was the driver and owner of the car, and all night long I could not get enough of him, I enjoyed every minute of his company.  They stayed until the sun came up.  Then I had to say goodbye, to which I really didn't want to.

I was afraid I would never see him again and I had to know if he felt how I did, like I found my other half.  he was just so gentle and kind.  I didn't really know him though and had no idea how to reach him, until I found his friend's shirt in my house (he wore layers) and his phone number I had.

We had a rough start, as I was followed around by my ex, and he by his.  I almost walked away from him one night never to see him again because of his ex and her relentless following and harsh attitude towards me.  The only thing that made me stay was his sister told me how much he cared for me already, and this was only 1 month or so later.

at the two and a half month mark I was about ready to walk the stage and accept my diploma saying I graduated high school, my ex had already been invited so I went with him, my mom was not stupid though and knew that there was something wrong with me and my ex and that this new guy who was taking all my time was someone who meant a lot to me, and she still did not know about the abuse so she was confused that I would "throw away a 3 year relationship" for this new guy.

She confronted me about it and I told her everything, and she told me she would deal with my ex, to which I told her leave it alone, I had dealt with him.  She then asked me the 20 questions about Scott.  She approved of him until she heard he was 4 years older then me, but what could she do?  I lived by my own rules, and was an adult now.

Many weeks later I had to phone her to tell her I was pregnant at 18, and it was Scott's who I had just met a couple months earlier.  By that time I was 2 months along, so I had walked my stage pregnant. 

It was a hard way to start a relationship but it happened.

[PonyMama]

So here we are now, a new couple, fresh out of relationships that were bad expecting a baby, but we decided what was best for us was to see where it took us, we moved in together and were going to raise the baby.  1 year after we met we had our first daughter.

It was rough, we fought a lot.  My biggest issue at that point was that eh was only working part time and he figured since I stayed at home and he went to work 3 days a week for only at max 5 hour shifts, he could play video games the other days to relax, instead of help me with this baby, he helped me create.

Slowly after a while, after her first birthday, things started to calm down, and we were enjoying each others company again.  Before she turned 2 he was offered a full time job in a city where we knew nobody, had no family and would have to be alone.  After much discussion we realized this financially would be best for our family of three and we packed up and left.  It was great to start then slowly started to go to crap.  He worked all week long so I did everything, child care, clean, cook, laundry, everything a house wife should do, and as return for this instead of thanking me for any of this he complained on the days where I was tired and couldn't clean well enough.  I slowly sank into a depression thinking I was not good enough and meant very little, and slowly started to pull away from him, as he was always too tired after work to do anything with us, and when I tried it was a huge fight.  Yet he still proposed to me that Christmas.

It continued this way for a couple more years, but we did have times of great enjoyment with each other.  I thought although we had some issues it wasn't so bad.  I went about trying to get things to function without it being a fight and plan a wedding.  We are both very non traditional so the date I had picked we were both find of and I went about planning.  I told him I need some money for some invites that I would make myself, closer to the date, and he told me I was pressuring him to get married.  I was confused and discussed with him what a wedding was, eh told me he didn't want to plan so much, so I took  that as he wanted it to just be us and some witnesses, so that worked for me, our families would be upset but would deal.  He however didn't want to do anything, he wouldn't even go get a wedding licence.  I tried to get him to talk to me but he wouldn't, I tried to get him to realize we were running out of time.

A week before the date, I told him we need to book the guy, and get the licence and he told me then we had no money for it, I told him I have almost all of it saved myself, but he refused to chip in $50.  So after 1 and a half years of trying to plan this wedding, it blew up in my face.  I was sad, crying, depressed and  feeling like he no longer wanted me, only to have him say it meant nothing to him anyways, that I was making him rush into it.  Hello we have now been together 6 years, we had a 5 year old we had been engaged for 3 years, how was that rushing?

Both my family and his asked more then once why it had not happened and I could not explain, and I no longer wished to talk about it, and to this day it still hurts.  This whole situation has been the focus of many conversations at this point, as I try and pull things together and figure out when we can get the funds together again and he is agreeing to marry me again.  He tells me that if I can get the money together he will marry me, so again with getting a small amount of money compared to him just by babysitting I get the money about 6 months later, this time when I say lets go do this, he asks me why I want to marry him.  I tell him because I love him, I have a family with him, I want to share my life with him.  Well apparently this was the wrong answer because I was told if that was the only reason he would not marry me again.  So yet another time passes.  This continues for the next couple years, until I am completely and totally broken down and the mention of marriage hurts.  He is now supervisor in his job, working more hours and we are farther apart then ever.  Yet we still try and connect to try save our family for our daughter.

[PonyMama]

Summer 2008, we find out that through discussion we both would love another child, and unfortunately we decide and less then a couple months later, October we are pregnant.  It happened quicker then we both hoped, but we are sort of happy.  I was thrilled he sunk into a depression this time and pulled away from me more.   He pulled away so much that instead of talking to me he spent most his nights on the computer talking to a work "friend".  he wouldn't stay up past 9 to spend any time with me, but he would stay up until 2am when he had to get up at 5 to go to work talking to her, while I was pregnant.  I saw what was going on and anytime I tried to talk to him about it, and tell him I was uncomfortable where his relationship was going, he pulled away more and started to hide his conversations with her.

January, only a couple months into my pregnancy, I find out I have high level hormones in my system which can be an indicator of Downs Syndrome for my baby, I must go to Vancouver when they have an appointment for me to check things out.  I was freaking and stressed and dealing with everything by myself because Scott wanted to spend him time on the computer, talking to this other girl.  I felt very alone.  I did however get him to talk to me about what we should do about the appending appointment, and we agree that this was a planned pregnancy, we already love her so we would not do anything that could hinder the pregnancy, they could do the ultrasound, but they would not be doing any test where they stick needles into her sack, which could result in a miscarriage.

So February comes around and I go to Vancouver, he can't take time off work and we don't want to pull my other daughter out of school, so he stays behind and she stays at a friends, because he works too long for him to take care of her without help.  Luckily I have my mom there for support, and I needed it at that point.  Luckily they felt nothing was wrong with her and told me it was looking like a false positive, I breathed a sigh of relief and was excited to tell Scott and have him come get me the next day to go home.  This is where my hole life blew up in my face.

I get to my moms and know Scott is still at work so I go to facebook and I have games I play that I use his account to get further into it, so I go to log onto his and I am blocked, he changed the password.  I can change it back, but why would he change it?  I phone him at work and he tells me he did not change it.  This was lie #1 of many.  Lots of things happened, when he got home from work and phoned me.  While I was on the phone with him I changed his password back only to have him change it again, so I changed it to something he did not know and decided to take a peek around to see what he was hiding, that is when I found it.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Please realize this is the exact conversation I found

Scott: some days you just want to leave the world behind, but where do you go and not be found
Sometimes I would rather be alone, wishing I was just thoughts in my head.
I am happy where I'm at knowing I have you as a friend who will just hold when I'm not wanting to be and that's maybe all I want
and F* you and your no cuddles

other girl: it turns me on......I'm sorry
I can't practice self restraint

Scott: why be sorry.....I really enjoyed visiting you and well I have to say you turn me on.  I would even visit you tonight but I get the fun of listening to *My daughter* read pokemon, weeeeeee
Oh well I don't mind
hey wtf you said you were making cake that's the only reason I came to visit.

Other girl: hahahaha I got distracted and *My sister* was drama with her hw.
Making it tonight
If you are lucky I might save you a piece

Scott: better, I would even come at 9 in the morning but you would probably be sleeping.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I confronted him with this as he no longer had access to his facebook, and he told me it was a big joke.  it was a big mess, I was out of town checking on the health of my unborn baby and he was cheating on me, when he should have been caring for our older child.

*Ok need a small break I am crying*

We stayed on the phone all night while he continued to lie to me, telling me he didn't do anything, that wasn't him talking nothing.  I even went as far as to use my cell phone to get her number and phone her.  So while on my mom's phone with him I phoned her on my cell.  I told her straight out to stay away from him or I would have no issue beating her no matter what condition I was in, you do not cheat with a married man and expect to get away with it.  Yeah I know I am still not married to him, but living common law for this long allows me to say we are married.  I then told Scott that he would not be getting his facebook account back, and if he ever saw her again I would leave him in a heartbeat.  I hated feeling like I was controlling but I was so hurt and for this to work I had to know that she was not around.

He came to pick me up the next morning, holding onto the lie he created the night before, and this was going to be a long 4 hour drive, as I refused to let him get away with lying.  We did not get a block away from my mom's before he broke down and told me the truth that he did write that.  However he says he never went to her house.  I got told a lot of crap and believe me some of it I told him he was not getting away with and that I was not going to take it.

He went from everything to it was nothing, they were just talking openly, to it was my fault, to he never thought it would hurt me.  Also through much talking he also told me I pressured him into proposing and he never wanted to get married, so I gave him his ring back, and he told me he does now but he didn't then and didn't know how to talk to me about it.  he told me he didn't mean to hurt me so much and understands that he did.  He also ended up giving my ring back and letting me know he wants to marry me still.  We spent the next week talking and trying to figure out the gives and takes and making things better.

[PonyMama]

Over the next little while we prepared, through many tears from me to have him go out of town for 5 weeks, with all this very fresh in my mind.  I was miserable and very untrusting.  The extra stresses did not help my pregnancy and I felt more tired, and was eating way less then I should have been.

He was gone for the week and came back weekends, this happened for 4 weeks then on the 5th week I went with him as it was spring break, we even brought one of my daughter's friends with us.

The week was stressful, I was weak, and moody, and stressed, plus I almost lost Scott not a month before, and my mother and grandmother were saying rude things to me, and were being just very inconsiderate to my feelings.  yeah my grandma was going blind but she refused to deal with it so why should I coddle her?  I have my own freaking problems to deal with and I am trying to visit not take on extra issues.

Either way the week ended with my mom pushing me and us having a screaming match.  All because I sent a kid to bed of not listening.  Well considering it was 2 hours past bedtime anyways I don't see where the issue was, and her mother who I was on the phone with agreed with me, and told me to tell her hugs and kisses.  My mom who had been drinking decided to take her out of bed, even when I said no leave her alone you are not in charge, and the screaming started, she held on so tight to my friend's daughter that the poor kid was scared, it took me and Scott to get her away and back downstairs.  We left the next morning and I refused to talk to my mom again for a long time.

I did get emails from her telling me I was a bad mom, and that I was so moody that nobody wanted to be with me and I had no right to be.  Well excuse me for being pregnant and not wanting to be told that I don't care for my child, and things like this.  I then responded back that she did not have to be part of my life and that if she thought so little of me then it would be better if she wasn't, and that ended that.

Scott had to spend one more week there and he got treated as normal, but when we got into arguments after he told me how I started it all, and no wonder my mom and grandma tell me these things, and that I was a bad mom.  He has apologized for saying those but they still hurt, he says them to hurt me, and it works.

After his work out of town was finished we continue our talking only for him to explain that eh never wanted to give me a ring, and didn't want to get married and that I was always making him do things he never wanted to do.  The only thing I could do was to give him his ring back, cancel all plans of getting married until he could prove to me he wanted to, and ask him why an adult could be forced to do things.  We fought for days about this and he admitted he was stressed, and that he was worried we were growing apart and that he had no idea how to fix it.  he also told me he wanted to get married and he was having a hard time thinking it could all be for nothing.  Finally he was talking to me.

we spent a bit more time talking and came to some compromise.  We agreed that if it got too bad we would go seek counselling as a couple and get past this and try and work on us, as our family meant the world to us both.  We also agreed that marriage should only happen once, and that we did not want to divorce, so we would wait until we were in a better place before agreeing to get married again.

After our second daughter was born he told me he wanted to get married, I asked him when he said within the next 6 months, I told him I would love that, plan it I would be there.

[PonyMama]

So now here we are, almost 9 months later, still not married, and getting wedding invite after wedding invite.  I feel horrible, so I try discuss it with him, and again I am getting the whole, I am pressuring him, he doesn't want to, I am not giving him the right reason, I don't take it seriously, pretty much anything to make it ok for us not to be married, although he says he wants to still.

The last three nights have been discussions about this very thing.  I am stressed, and exhausted in trying to find the solution to this problem, because I want to be married to him, and be his family, but it just seems he doesn't want to be part of mine. I am at a loss.  I have avoided weddings over the past 5 years, but this year we have his sisters wedding, and a good friend of his, who is marrying a girl who shares a lot of family with me (yet we are not related), and then my brother got engaged.  How do I avoid these without seeming bitter, because I won't be able to be happy for them when I am hurting inside.  I have been through so much with him over 9 years, and it just seems as though he doesn't want me enough.

So I am asking you guys, if you have read through this big long story, my life for the past many years, what do I do?  I cry at the drop of a hat, when wedding invites come in the mail I bawl, he has said so many hurtful things about getting married I am at a loss for whether I should or not.  I am happy with him, I really am, I know after reading this it seems like I am not, but we get through all the difficult times.  Yeah we are still working on the one of him cheating on me, but that will take time.  I just don't know what to do anymore.

[Goddesss]

*big hugs for PM*

I read through this and I want to respond but I am feeling really sick right now and need to lay down.  I will respond in a bit I just wanted to give you a hug.

[PonyMama]

I just needed to get that all off my chest.  Trying to talk to anyone around me is useless as they can't hear it and make a judgment.

[Neocridders]

I read through this, and I just want to give you a hug.

So sorry you've had to deal with this.
I can't believe he just keeps telling you the same things. That he never wanted to get married, and that you forced it on him, and then that he does want to get married.

I think it is sad that he has done that to you so many times
I think if he loves you and you love him, you will get married. You obviously love him.
But, I think he seems like the type that just doesn't like commitment.

I can't offer much advice, as I've never had a situation like this.
But even if things don't work out with you and Scott, atlease you have two wonderful children.

I hope things work out for you <3
*hugs*

[PonyMama]

he feels we are commited and that shoudl be enough for me, adn I guess I have no choice but to accept that it might have to be, but it just feels wrong

[Goddesss]

I do want to reply to this I have pretty much been laid up on the couch all day.  I have typed a reply twice and when I get close to the end I dont know why but when I press shift an i it erases what I had written.  I  dont know if it is the forum or my laptop.  I have to put the baby to bed and then I will try again.  I just didnt want you to think I forgot about you.  I have a hard time putting my thoughts togeather as it is and it keeps erasing so I have to do it all over. =)

[PonyMama]

no worries goddesss

[Silvanon]

*hugs*

Ok, here's my thoughts:  If you absolutely need something in order to be happy in a relationship, then it is not manipulative or controlling to insist upon it.  What is manipulative and controlling is to continually string someone along with the offer of someday giving them what they need, when you have no intention of actually giving it.  

While I was dating Conrad it got to the point that I had to hand out an ultimatum.  We'd been dating for some time, and he kept wishie-washing back and forth about whether he wanted to marry me or not.  He knew that I wouldn't be happy and wouldn't stay with him if he didn't marry me, but he was afraid of the "ultimate committement" of marriage.  Finally I told him, "You need to be serious and make a decision because I'm not going to wait for forever."  That wasn't controling or manipulative.  It was laying out for Conrad what his choices were and what the consequences of those choices would be.  In our case, Conrad decided he wanted me more than he feared committement, and we got married.  If he hadn't been willing to marry me, then I would have left the relationship and found another guy who would marry me.

Reading over what you've said, I think you could very truthfully tell Scott that you will never be truly happy in this relationship until he marries you, and that he may eventualy lose you over the issue if he isn't willing to do that for you.  Simple fact, there's his choices, now he can choose.  

And, for the record, there's no "should" when it comes to people's feelings.  Telling someone they "should" feel a certain way is besides the point, it doesn't change how the person really feels.  It's a feeble excuse by someone who doesn't want to go through the effort to deal with another person's feelings.  Even if the "should" is exactly true for a fantasy ideal world,  "should" isn't the point.  Reality is the point, and the reality is that you feel unhappy being unmarried.

I don't know nearly enough details to be handing out any advice about whether your relationship is worth sticking in or not.  Really you need to decide that for yourselves - he needs to decide if he's willing to make you happy by marrying you, and depending on his choice you need to decide if you want to live that way for the rest of your life or not.  

[PonyMama]

I feel it is worth sticking it out, adn from what he as told me he feels that way too, so maybe I do need to sit down with him and let him know, I want to get married, and hand him the give it or go type reason.  We get along great as long as we don't talk about marriage, but I think youa re right, it needs to all be put on the table and dealt with, not have it continually shuffled aside.

That was helpful, thank you

[Silvanon]

*hugs*

[IvySpring]

I in no way have any credibility to offer advice in this situation, but I feel like I should reply, just because your post was so heartbreaking; I cannot in any way imagine going through something like that.

First I would like to seriously say that I admire your courage in sticking with Scott even with the current situation. I cannot possibly imagine how hard it is for you to have gone through that and still be faithful to him, but I really do admire it, just because I think keeping a family together is such an important thing to try and do in today's world.

If you truly do love him- I agree with Silv: there needs to be some sort of option that you need to give him, and if he's not willing to work with what you truly need out of this relationship, then you cannot torture yourself and be his safety net only for when he needs you. A relationship is a mutual, two-person job that takes the hard work of both sides to flourish. If he really does love you as much as he says he does, and as much as you believe he does, then he will be able to understand that and be able to work with you to make things right for both of you, and for your daughters. Unfortunately, if he is not able to give your relationship and family what they need from him, then it's only hurting you and your girls to constantly give and just be a backup for when he feels like being committed.

I don't mean to sound so negative about Scott- I understand that not everything is perfect, and the fact that he has stayed with you this long shows a lot of character and maturity from him. But it's ok to do things for yourself every once and a while to, and to know that you need to take care of yourself sometimes :]

If anything, I hope this reply just gives you the comfort of knowing we're all here for you whenever you need it (even if my advice sucks >_<- but I'm trying :]). Keep us updated, and if you ever need to escape from the real world- we're here :]

[PonyMama]

I do understand where he is coming from about he why do we have to get married to commit to eachother thing, and he says he understands my need to join and become a family in papers for all to see (probably not best way to put it but explains easiest).  However we are both unable to meet in the middle and figure this out.  I am glad I can come here and get some outsider help and hope that when the subject is brought up again that him and I can come to an agreement that will actually work for us both.

I do hope to bring everyone good news

[PonyMama]

Update:
I decided to put all my feelings in and tell him that if we are not striving for the same goal here then there was really no reason for us to stay together, because unfortunately I wanted to get married enough that I was not goign to be truly happy without that commitment.  Yes we have two children but we both know that they mean the world to us both and no matter what they are first, btu somewhere in there we needed to decide what was best for us.

So we decided that marriage is something we are both striving for, and that when the funds become available it is as simple as getting the lisence, and the guy and saying I do.  No big wedding, no white dress, and no family.  Just us and our kids and two witnesses.  This is all I really want, just us sayign we want to be with eachother, plus I am super shy and don't want my entire family watchign me while I stand at the front of any room talking.  Not in a million years.  I was also never one to see myself in a white wedding dress, which works for him becasue he knows I don't like them, plus he doesn't want to wear a tux. Plus my gramma ruined it for me when I planned the wedding the first time, she told me straight out "you can't wear white, you know you aren't fooling anyone"  Whatever gramma.

So as it stands right now we are talking, he knows he let me down and he dropped the ball, when he shoudl have talked to me to let me knwo he was scared he decided not to and that created a bigger issue.  Also with this being the focal point of the coversation eh also admitted that he feels that he is letting us all down, that maybe all this is his fault, right down to our oldest daughter causing problems, he figures he shoudl be giving us more attention in the evenings, but he just doesn't knwo hwo anymore, as we all gave up trying and just started pulling away. 

We have a lot of work but at least we got some on the way to worked out....hopefully!

[Silvanon]

*hugs*  That was really brave of you to put your feelings on the table, I'm proud of you for doing that.  And sounds like it had a good result.  That's awesome that you can both be working towards the same goal! 

[Tribe]

Wow pm you are brave and awesome for doing this. I wish i could spill like this, i think itd make me feel better. I may have to write like this soon as not to go crazy waiting on my hubby to get back.

My first reaction to this is to tell you something you dont want to hear, and trust me hurt is the last thing i want to make you feel however im cold cut and dry with relationships so i have to say it.

Firstly i know know what you feel for scott, its the same kind of undieing love that i feel for my husband even though i shouldve really considered leaving him more then once. It makes you quiver at the sign that you may lose him, it makes you shake angry when you think someone could take him. Its a kind of love that can make you sick to your stomach or the happiest person to ever walk this earth. You need it, its something built into people like us and we just cant live without it.

I know having two kids makes a choice to leave thier father so incredibly hard, and even with me being as young as i am, i am wise beyond my years. I know growing up with an abusive (verbally only as far as i know) step father made me hate that man beyond any comprehension (SP?). There were nights that id hear him fight with my mother and call her bad things and treat her horridly that i thought the only way to resolve the issue was to destory the man. Albeit i obviously did not carry out my thoughts i really wanted to at points. There was one time though and i must say the last time i ever him heard him say those aweful things, i heard him say i wish my mother would just die and if she touched his sh*t again hed break her fingers. This to me was enough of a threat to her that i at my whole 5' 2" slim stature stormed to that man and let loose on him. Between how loud i was and how much i was saying he had no come back, no way to try to yell back. The police were called he was carted of and i felt much better at that point. My mother now is still with this man today and even though hes so much better now (via pills) i still in my gut hate him for all hes ever done.

I guess my point is i wouldve so much rather my mother leave that man then make me hate him as much as i do. I tell my husband when we fight that i wont do that to my son, i wont let him hate his own father and that if it comes to a time that i feel he cant/ we cant fix things i will leave because i wont let my son hear those aweful words i had to. Seeing from what you said it seems a never ending battle is going on between you two maybe you should think for your children is it okay for them to hear this or do they need to be removed from the situation (as you need to be to).

Personally before my husband left (just 3 days ago) i was just at the end of my straw. I was always thinking god i could do better, i deserve better why would i stay with someone im not completely happy with. Now that hes gone hes finally seen how much me and epic and this new baby mean to him. Though he wants badly to come home and tell us all this im making him stay at his military thing for the whole two weeks just so he knows exactly how his life would feel without us so maybe this is what you need to do love, be away for a bit.

[indigowulf]

I know this isn't what you want to be thinking about right now, but if you do seperate, you need to be prepared for a custody battle. I would recomend keeping any and all information you have that could prove he was being unfaithful, as it could help. Especially if he was at some womans house when he was supposed to be taking care of his daughter, and couldnt be bothered to go to the medical thing for his unborn baby.

[PonyMama]

We have already worked out custody, so he won't fight me on that.   
He works 12 hour days, so he gets them on his days off and whenever he is hoem and asks for them, he gets them every second xmas and other then that they are in my care.  He knows that becasue of leavign before 6am to go to work and not coming home until after 6pm that he will nto be the best parent for the kids to live with.

And yes the conversation is saved in an email he doesn't know about, and I also have it written out.